Curse

PieXags · May 23, 2005, 02:56 AM // 02:56

Yeah I'll be siding with Gnome and Xelig on this one. Rusty, we're not against it because it's "unpopular" we're against it because it's wrong, it offends several people, and as a whole, it makes the game less fun to play.

If this goes against whatever "freedom of speech" you care to dream about then I don't really know what to tell you, this isn't the country we're talking about, we're not trying to change your state laws or anything. We're trying to point out that the racist (and I'll even go for homophobic) comments seen in-game take away from the enjoyable experience.

If you don't think removing something to make the community better is a good thing...well, this isn't just America buddy, it's a game, and the game makers make the rules. So...tough? Yeah, tough.

Cheers.

fleeb · May 23, 2005, 03:17 AM // 03:17

I'll echo BlainTog's remarks concerning anti-gay comments I've seen, repeatedly, throughout GW in open chat and during team-chat.

It's rampant, much more so than racist comments.

In my opinion, picking on any minority requires a lack of self respect or self worth. But picking on a minority that has the least support of the public strikes me as particularly cowardly.

Gays aren't quite the least supported, but they're darned close (transgendered people are the least supported group... and you'd be very surprised at how many transgendered people play games like this). Fortunately, I don't see a lot of anti-transgendered chatting, but I think it probably speaks more to a lack of imagination than any altruism on the part of the community at large.

I've participated in a lot of teams with members who have repeatedly written anti-gay epiteths. I've never commented to the team members about it, as in my opinion, it says more about the individual saying such things than it does about gays. But I never support such people in their words.

All of this said, I think this happens because there are a lot of very young people in this community. They haven't met a wide variety of folks, and they have this computer between them and the world. This provides seeming bravery where none truly exists.

I've long noticed this kind of pattern, when you first start using the computer as a communication media, to blurt out some of the most outrageous stuff that you'd never say in public. Over time, though, as you develop an online community of friends and such, you find yourself changing your writing habits out of necessity. Maybe you discover that such-and-so person is really and truly a gay man, but you learned to like the person. Or that other person is a pre-op male-to-female transgendered person, but kicks ass on GW.

Or maybe, more simply, you find people tend to respect you more when your words provide insight and interest rather than condemnation and nastiness.

In any event, you can kind of get an idea how old someone is by whether they're using racial/gender slurs or not.

eventhorizen · May 23, 2005, 05:26 AM // 05:26

Maybe, but it doesnt matter how old an individual is, what their sexuality is, or what country they were born in/ethnic group they belong to, all that matters is the FILTH that comes pouring out of peoples minds onto other players screens via this game every day.

Although yes, I too believe the vast majority of this type of abuse comes from the hands of people in their teens, there are plenty people who's 'apparant' age seems to be much older, yet their words drip with as much hate, and spite, and vileness.

As players of this game, as human beings, we all suffer when we are subject to this kind of abuse, whether it was meant for us or not. When we play GW we are all sitting in front of our computers, and for a brief time we all are exaclty the same, and can easilly imagine what a hateful spiteful racial slur feels like, even if its not directed at us.

Warn them a.net, then ban them. There should be no other way of treating people that do this.

Striker Shardale · May 23, 2005, 06:20 AM // 06:20

Interesting...just as I was reading the latest posts on this thread John Lennon's "Imagine" began to play in my headphones. I think we could all have learned a thing or two from that man. By the way, I must just add that you cannot just single out the teens. Although I am 19 and legallyas well as spiritually (my old church) considered an adult I am still a teenager (nine-teen). I know you are not saying it is just teens but that is not my point and right nwo I just feel like adding something out of pure boredom and sleepiness.

For those of you whom are filled with the hate...I would like to recommend a few songs for you if you do not mind::

LIVE -Lightning Crashes
Switchfoot - Meant To Live
MUDVAYNE - World So Cold
Black Eyed Peas - Where Is The Love?
John Lennon and Yoko Ono - IMAGINE
Weezer - Island In The Sun

And play them in that order and actually listen to the lyrics... if that does not make you somewhat normal...try listening to a soundtrack to The Animaniacs a couple hundred times, that CD is proven to make you either happier or crazy. So, we can either accept you after that or send you to an asylum.

Now I go pass out...hopefully that post made sense.

eA-Zaku · May 23, 2005, 06:29 AM // 06:29

Quote:

We hit an evolutionary bottleneck at some point (I forget when) that accounts for this

Maybe around the time when God sent the Flood to destroy everyone except Noah and his family

fleeb · May 23, 2005, 01:43 PM // 13:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by eventhorizen

Maybe, but it doesnt matter how old an individual is, what their sexuality is, or what country they were born in/ethnic group they belong to, all that matters is the FILTH that comes pouring out of peoples minds onto other players screens via this game every day.

Strength comes from within.

As a minority in my own right, and having suffered abuses of this nature for my entire life, I can assure you that, even though one may call me terrible names, and wrongly besmirch my character, I know who I am, and that's all that matters. At worst, someone can only convince others of something that is not true, but it weakens the person doing such a thing.

My self-worth matters more to me than what someone else says of me, and more than what anyone else may think of me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by eventhorizen

Although yes, I too believe the vast majority of this type of abuse comes from the hands of people in their teens, there are plenty people who's 'apparant' age seems to be much older, yet their words drip with as much hate, and spite, and vileness.

Younger people have not necessarily learned how to defend themselves with their own inner strength, because they're still growing. They don't necessarily have a lot of inner strength. So they erroneously build their own self-worth by tearing down others around them.

It's actually a rather sad state of affairs.

I realize this sounds contrary to normal reasoning, but I think it's more constructive to feel sorrow for such people than ire.

Unfortunately, some people allow this to go on far longer than their youth. But, in my experience, most people mellow over time, at least as far as expressing their particular venom openly. An older person may still hate a minority group of some kind, but it's more like a bad habit that embarrasses them to some degree than anything they'd openly spout.

I suppose a simpler way to phrase this is that, amongst the young, it seems 'cool' to bash a minority group. But as you get older, you just look like an idiot, so you start to keep it to yourself.

Quote:

Originally Posted by eventhorizen

As players of this game, as human beings, we all suffer when we are subject to this kind of abuse, whether it was meant for us or not. When we play GW we are all sitting in front of our computers, and for a brief time we all are exaclty the same, and can easilly imagine what a hateful spiteful racial slur feels like, even if its not directed at us.

We suffer whenever another around us suffers. This is a kind of secret in life that a lot of people miss.

A sick man has a tendency to snap at his nurse. It isn't that he truly hates her, but because he is in pain, and has a need to release some of that pain. Unfortunately, he is redistributing it, after a fashion, to those who bear him no ill-will, but it's natural to do this. Such people could use a little understanding.

The people who spout such ugliness either do it out of ignorance, or weakness. I would rather help them grow than diminish them.

One way to help someone like that grow may be through banning them. But each case is unique.. it's hard to say.

Quote:

Originally Posted by eventhorizen

Warn them a.net, then ban them. There should be no other way of treating people that do this.

It is a way to treat such people, but I don't know if it's either the best way, or the only way such folks should be treated.

I have surprised many a person in my life by getting to know them, allowing them to get to know me, and then revealing the minority group I belong to at an appropriate time. In every case, people found it to be a healing experience, as it helped them to diffuse their hatred, especially since I've never condemned anybody for treating me badly.

Perishiko ReLLiK · May 23, 2005, 01:59 PM // 13:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Striker Shardale

I think they need to make the sigils a little more frequent at the trader. The last thing I really want to do is save up all of that gold to have to buy it off somebody. I do not even consider there to be a price for the sigil anymore, basically it is whatever some guy wants to set it as.

Sigils are funny, outrageous prices for something that will sooner or later come in a great abundance... ill wait till they're dirt cheap to get one... i can wait till everyone else has a guild hall, heh... then they wont be so "needed".

Patience is a virtue?

Playful Kitty · May 23, 2005, 02:02 PM // 14:02

Originally Posted by Perishiko ReLLiK
We also need to teach these idiot americans(of course not all, im just narrowing it down to the idiots) that koreans CAN and DO speak english... i had one person reply to me "It was just a joke, cause i know they can't speak our language".

~~~~~~~~~~~~

um excuse me but us Americans need to teach you idiot koreans a lesson or two. Why dont you all stop crying. You all are being racial to us in that crossed line figure language of yours. America is number 1 and always will be, so of course we are going to think (well know) we are better than everyone else. You all are going to have to accept that. should i go on?

Perishiko ReLLiK · May 23, 2005, 02:06 PM // 14:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Playful Kitty

Originally Posted by Perishiko ReLLiK
We also need to teach these idiot americans(of course not all, im just narrowing it down to the idiots) that koreans CAN and DO speak english... i had one person reply to me "It was just a joke, cause i know they can't speak our language".

~~~~~~~~~~~~

um excuse me but us Americans need to teach you idiot koreans a lesson or two. Why dont you all stop crying. You all are being racial to us in that crossed line figure language of yours. America is number 1 and always will be, so of course we are going to think (well know) we are better than everyone else. You all are going to have to accept that. should i go on?

1. We are not #1, our allies are making us #1, if it weren't for them, we'd be at war with the world.
2. A huge percentage of americans are obese, not a good thing to be #1 at.
3. Americans have the highest rate of gun killings, another thing not to be #1 at.
4. A huge percentage of americans are racist, yet another thing, not good to be #1 at.
5. A huge percentage of americans don't know what "America" stands for, yet more things not good to be #1 at. (blame the schools)
6. Should **I** go on?

Could someone slap the living crap out of this person for me?
Moron... that's all i have to say. I'm american, you stupid dolt.
I just have a serious problem with jackasses such as yourself.
Besides the fact that it's their LANGUAGE, and they're going to speak in it... you should step back onto that train called "life".

**And i thought american's like this couldn't become any more moronic.**

Message to dev's -- Close this thread!

Playful Kitty · May 23, 2005, 02:10 PM // 14:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Perishiko ReLLiK

Could someone slap the living crap out of this person for me?
Moron... that's all i have to say. I'm american, you stupid dolt.
I just have a serious problem with jackasses such as yourself.
Besides the fact that it's their LANGUAGE, and they're going to speak in it... you should step back onto that train called "life".

**And i thought american's like this couldn't become any more moronic.**

Message to dev's -- Close this thread!

Your american... well not anymore. TRAITOR!

Corwin_Andros · May 23, 2005, 02:15 PM // 14:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Playful Kitty

um excuse me but us Americans need to teach you idiot koreans a lesson or two. Why dont you all stop crying. You all are being racial to us in that crossed line figure language of yours. America is number 1 and always will be, so of course we are going to think (well know) we are better than everyone else. You all are going to have to accept that. should i go on?

Playful Kitty.. PLEASE... Don't go on. It's bad enough that most of the world has such a dim view of our country without this kind of drivel. Having national pride is all well and good. But spewing out this kind of nonsense does nothing but strengthen people's bad opinion of the US, when quite a lot of us are perfectly reasonable individuals.

What I'd like to know is how many people talking about how great the US or whatever country you might be from is compared to other countries, have even been to a foreign land?

I've lived in Europe and I spent a year living in Korea. I can tell you that what we have here in the US isn't all that much better in a lot of cases.. and is in some instances worse than other countries. But for the most part things here are not any better or worse.. just different.

Just do us all a favor though.. and this is directed at everyone. If you can't refrain from spitting out inane garbage when posting.. please just refrain from posting at all. All it is doing is spreading hatred and misunderstanding.. which is something the world has in more than enough abundance without people adding to it over a video game.

Playful Kitty · May 23, 2005, 02:34 PM // 14:34

LOL you cant be serious, if you dont like america well leave it. We are the ones fighting all of these wars and mostly noone else helping. our allies? hmm we only got like few allies we actually like. everyone is scared of america. the only reason you live here is cause how good we are. how much better we are. racism has always been around and always will be. let me guess you must be the kid who is made fun of at school and has no gfs so he hates america. well why dont you just move to korea or somewhere. o and all those things you mentioned well 90% of all statistics are made up. they just put high numbers to make it look pretty.

Corwin_Andros · May 23, 2005, 03:20 PM // 15:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Playful Kitty

LOL you cant be serious, if you dont like america well leave it. We are the ones fighting all of these wars and mostly noone else helping. our allies? hmm we only got like few allies we actually like. everyone is scared of america. the only reason you live here is cause how good we are. how much better we are. racism has always been around and always will be. let me guess you must be the kid who is made fun of at school and has no gfs so he hates america. well why dont you just move to korea or somewhere. o and all those things you mentioned well 90% of all statistics are made up. they just put high numbers to make it look pretty.

I'm not sure who you are referring to, but I for one never said anything about not liking America. As to us fighting all these wars and all, I agree that we are fighting a lot without a lot of worldwide support. As for being a kid.. not in many many moons. I spent time in Europe and Korea during my 14 1/2 years in the US military. I have seen first hand what other countries are like and what the people that live there are like. Other than a tendancy to a more homogenous appearance and different language.. they aren't all that different than we are.

You on the other hand seem to have gathered your opinions from CNN or perhaps MTV. I'm not saying you are completely wrong in everything you think.. Our country is a great one and has many things that other countries don't. What I am saying is that we are not the end all be all for the world..

Grow up.. move away from mommy and daddy and go out into the the great big world (meaning OTHER countries) and see it with your own two eyes and not just on television. Spend time away from the good 'ol US of A and you just might gain a greater respect and understanding for others in the process.

the geckooo · May 23, 2005, 03:24 PM // 15:24

If you dont like us "Idiot americans" why dont you find your own "Idiot Korean" game where you can complain about americans all you want.
~have a nice day =)

Ramus · May 23, 2005, 03:25 PM // 15:25

Why hasn't an admin or moderator closed this thread yet? It has turned into nonsense and country-bashing.

EnDinG · May 23, 2005, 03:35 PM // 15:35

Sorry, I was away for the weekend. Thread is closed.

Would you show your mother what you said? No? Didn't think so.
Generally, we wouldn't want to see it up here either.

Thread closed, anymore threads or posts like this and I'll bring in the admin banning machines to take care of people who think its ok to post racist material up.

Do not do it again. Ever. On these boards.